difference between 428 and 428 cobra jet difference between 428 and 428 cobra jet

Not Ranked. The axle code in the order image is "8" (which means 3.50:1 open) and the car's data plate has an axle code of "W". The 428 Cobra and Super Cobra Jets continued for 1970, but there was also a new 429 Cobra Jet now. Mustang 428 Cobra Jet Service Parts Oil Level Indicator (Dip Stick) Oil Pan and Windage Tray Oil Pump Pistons Power Steering Fluid Cooler Power Steering Pump Radiator Radiator Cooling Fan Radiator Cooling Fan Shroud Radiator Fan Clutch Rear U-Joint Flange Reverse Lockout Rod (1970) Shock Tower Reinforcements Speedometer Gear Adapter you could be driving 15 mph and just floor it, and it would break the tires loose, you certainally didnt have to powerbreak it to spin the tires like every other car.my father had a 74 caprice with a 454 and the Tbird was far faster than the 454. But of course, it was too late to change the name. Now. The Mercury division of Ford put the 428 Cobra Jet in their Comets and Cyclones, and Shelby used one for his new GT500KR (King of the Road). Although these cars were slightly different than what would shortly be on the showroom floor, word was out that the Cobra Jet package was the way to go. The Boss and Cobra Jets had the same block with four bolt mains, short skirts, and thin wall castings. The 396 featured advanced-design, canted-valve cylinder heads that flowed like crazy and earned the name "porcupine" because of their splayed-valve arrangement. Still, a '71 'Jet had a 0-60 time of 6.5 seconds and a quarter-mile time of 14.1 seconds, so it was no snail. 1969 Ford Mustang Mach 1 428 Super Cobra Jet Muscle Car Of The Week Video Episode #91The Mach 1 handling and appearance package made for some good looking an. This is an internally ballance assy . That is, the performance motors were either a CJ or a SCJ. If I can, I will try to get a picture of the "SUPER" stamp to show. The basic casting is the same, but a 428 had a 4.13 inch bore and the 390 has a 4.05 bore stock. The 335hp rating was nothing more than a ploy to distract the NHRA from the CJ's true ability, in hopes of getting more advantageous classifications in Stock and Super Stock competition. Grue up with Ford FE. They have released new Cobra Jets every two years, with 2022 being the first exception so far. Nineteen-seventy was the last year for the venerable FE-series big-block engine in the Mustang and Cougar. Pioneered in 1967 as a stripped-down Holman and Moody prepared drag-ready Mustang for Tasca Ford, the 428 short block with 427 heads christened the KR-8 flawlessly balanced proven race engineering with factory Ford parts. As it turned out, the 427 heads massively improved both low-end torque and top-end power on 428. Very rare and very expensive as only about 1,200 were made. The 428 Cobra Jet powered some of the fastest Ford Muscle Cars from 1968 to 1970, over nine Ford and Mercury models. Cobra Jet engines received low-riser heads with a "rough-cast" combustion chamber (2.09int.-1.66ex. When identifying a Super Cobra Jet, you cant do it by the VIN as it shares the same R and Q code designations as the Cobra Jet. I want to register an account for free right now! The spirit of Bob Tasca and Carroll Shelbys original 427/428 hybrids still live on today if youre lucky enough to see one in person. The 427 quickly became one of the most popular and powerful Ford engines, pumping out 425 horsepower. The 429 Ford Cobra Jet pumped out 370 horsepower, while the Super Cobra Jets pushed out 375 horsepower. In April 1968, Ford released its own version of the 428 engine and called it the Cobra Jet.. The chambers were open head, which helped with emissions, and Ford fitted the Autolite/Ford 4300-D 750 cfm 4bbl carburetor to it. Even less common with a production of maybe 3,000. In lieu of reverting back to the factory 428 head castings, Tasca put heads from the 427 instead. Cast iron exhaust manifolds. This became a private war between the automakers. The big difference was the price (at $622, the 427 cost $188 more than the $434 428 CJ), transmission availability (the 427 was only teamed with the C6 automatic), carburetors (the 427's single. The CJ came in the GTs place, powered by a 428CJ and a Spoiler variation that appeared midyear with a standard rear wing. The big-block Chevy had the edge in breathing ability, but this move closed the gap between the two engines a great deal. Ford was not caught in flagrante delecto, however. With the elimination of the 428 Ford Cobra Jets after 1970, this left only the measly, low compression 351 Cobra Jet as the only one remaining for 1972-74. The World's largest A limited number of Cobra emblems placed strategically on the exterior warned people what lurked under the hood. It was a good-looking car featuring wide availability in its engine selection. The differences for the SCJ were: 1) The beefer 427 "LeMans" connecting rods. In addition, when equipped with a 4-speed, the rear shocks were staggered. Ford created a few high performance variants of the 429, the Boss 429 and the 429 Cobra/Super Cobra Jets. This was not enough to beat the big-block Camaro, however, which ran the quarter a full second quicker. ** I've also read reports of 428 CJ balancers with engineering numbers C8AE-AA and C8AE-AB, but I haven't personally seen one of these balancers -- have you? As we all understand, the 390 wasn't standing up to the 396, and sales reflected this. The A blocks were made until mid 1968 model year. The 396 was known in Bow Tie circles as the Mark IV and was further known as the "mystery motor" because it was developed in secret for the '64 Daytona 500. Not too common, maybe a total production of 15,000. Competition was tough in the late '60s, with both GM and Chrysler offering up serious big-block performance. the 428 CJ. The back of the CJ block should have a "C" cast or welded into the back of it. The 1975 MPC clearly notes that the 1969 and 1970 radiator core supports were serviced using two different part numbers (C9ZZ-16138-A and D0ZZ-16138-A); the report I have is that the 1970 support is shaped in such a way that the bracket doesnt fit and isnt needed. I want to register an account for free right now! The SCJ block is the same as a CJ. You should feel lucky to have driven your 69 Bird. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding. See if you can determine if these motors you are looking at are CJ's. The car automatically became a Super Cobra Jet. For example, the SCJ used race-proven 427 "LeMans" capscrew connecting rods with shorter bolt heads, whereas the standard CJ rod used a more common press-fit bolt and nut to retain the rod cap. Because the NHRA used advertised factory horsepower and shipping weight claims to group vehicles into competition classes and categories, it paid to fib a little bit; 428 CJ-powered Mustangs and Fairlanes quickly became feared street and strip machines. The 428 CJ cylinder heads featured an un-machined chamber of 73-76cc, 2.06" intake valves and 1.66" exhaust valves. 370 HP (likely underrated), thick strong blocks and massive ports int he heads. Super Cobra Jet harmonic balancer counter weight, 3 Factory horsepower and torque ratings were the same for both CJ and SCJ engines. A special option available for 1969 in the Cobra Jet Mustang included a 428 with internal modifications. The rarest of the bunch are the 68's. The most vaulable Cobra Jet is the 1968 Shelby GT500KR convertibles, which can go for as much or more than a BOSS 429. Identified by the letter W in the fifth spot of the VIN, this early 1968 edition was the only 427 with hydraulic lifters, an iron intake manifold, a single point distributor, a smog pump (Ford's Thermactor system), an automatic transmission (the four-speed was not available with the 427), and optional air conditioning. Cobra Make, Engine: Posts: 717. The 406 was a serious development for Ford, as it catapulted them to NHRA and NASCAR victories in the mid-1960s. More than 18,000 were installed in 1968-1970 Mustangs alone. However, in true Cobra Jet fashion, Ford underestimated the horsepower from the factory. It was fortuitous that Tasca Ford nudged Fordand Ford listenedbecause the 428 Cobra Jets and Super Cobra Jets are amongst the baddest Ford Muscle Cars you could drive off the lot from 1968-1970. The Mustang had grown bigger than ever, with a weight of nearly two tons. 1999 - 2022 Scott A. Hollenbeck. It appears that Ford went through at least three piston designs during the 428 CJ and SCJ production run to address durability problems. The 428 Cobra and Super Cobra Jets continued for 1970, but there was also a new 429 Cobra Jet now. The C blocks started to be used in mid 1967 before the CJ production started. The heads ID themselves. 428 cobra jet vs. 460. i was wondering if a 428 cj or a 460 would be a better engine for a street rod. Lastly, Ford engineers externally balanced the SCJ engine with a counterweight behind a different harmonic balancer because they removed the center counterweight on the crank. The 428 was available as a 68 1/2, 68 and 70 model. Besides I have a reputation now First you have to start with the 428 v.s. In sixth place is the 1969 Mercury Cougar Eliminator. The Mercury Cougar underwent styling updates in 1969, including transitioning to Coke bottle styling and eliminating side vent windows. Dr. The Ford engineers kept the KR-8 so they could break it down and discover what made it so powerful. Yep, I'm a hack! I was wondering if anyone knows the difference between a regular 428 block and a 428 Cobra Jet block. Like the Chevy L-88 was 5 hp less than the trip set up Corvettes, because they lied their ass off to keep people from buying the L-88 who didn't know what they were getting into. The name is perhaps one of Ford's most enduring performance legacies. 428 CJ's came in the 69 so it would be more correct as far as appearance goes. The package included special capscrew-type connecting rods borrowed from the Ford GT Mark IV 427 Le Mans engine. Besides the T-Bird, there were Galaxies, Thunderbolt Fairlanes, Mustangs, Torinos, and both the AC Cobra and GT 500 Shelbys. Lets look at the differences between a 428 Cobra Jet and the 428 Super Cobra Jet engine, shall we? : For registered members this ad will NOT show. 428 Cobra Jet Standard was 2.09 inch intake and 1.66 inch exhaust valves. Compression was lowered from 10.7:1 to 9.0:1, and in 1971 it actually made 5 horsepower less than the standard 351 at 280 horsepower. Instead, "Tasca Ford"the second-largest Ford dealership in the world in the 1960sinspired the 428CJ revolution. Cobra Jet Mustang production continued into 1970. It may be possible to mix components if every component of the reciprocating assembly is dynamically balanced, but why bother? i am putting the motor in a FORD 1972 short bed single cab pickup. Note that it was not thought to be possible to order an SCJ engine by itself -- the only way to get your hands on an SCJ in a Mustang was to order the optional 3.91:1 or 4.30:1 rear end gear ratios. While both shared the same advertised horsepower and torque figures, the 428SCJ wasnt available with air conditioning due to the engines oil cooler location. In second place is the 1968 Ford Mustang 428 Cobra Jet. Yet, Ford did not use any of the second generation big blocks in pony cars like the Mustang at first. Basically, a 428 is just a stroked 390, and tuned for massive torque over horsepower. I want to register an account for free right now! Upgraded C6 with higher shift speed and modified clutch packs, New 6" HG with miminal exhaust restriction mufflers and pipes, Revised for staggered shock absorbers to eliminate reverse gear tramping. But there was one thing about the 428 CJ that left everyone puzzled. For improved high speed reliability, the SCJ used the . You can have it straight (CJ 428) or with optional CJ 428 Ram, the breathtaker. The CJ block differs from the plain 428 due to the additional webs cast into the main bearing saddles. Lots of people have different opinions about the "Drag Pack" option described above, what it included, and which cars it was available for. He had been involved in the Thunderbolt program back in 1964. I actually have some kind of answer that I hope will help. All Rights Reserved. valves), and the valves were closer together than on other FE heads so that the CJ . The SCJ timing pointer is slightly longer to clear the larger harmonic balancer. In fifth place is the 1969 Mercury Cyclone CJ. Unlike the 351, Ford based the 428 Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jets on the FE series of engines. These were sold as part of the Drag Pack option. The PI ran stock 390/428 heads, an aluminum intake, the same cam as the CJ and a 600 CFM carb. The rotating assemblies between the Cobra Jet and Super Cobra Jets are different, and mixing them leads to balance issues. The CJ had the good heads, cam but had the iron intake. Piston part numbers are marked (R) for red size and (B) for blue size to note options for selective fit based on normal production tolerances. Tim K, Cobra Make, Engine: Shell Valley- smallblock grenade w/ the pin pulled. It also saw the addition of a new convertible body style with a power top. They were almost identical to the standard Cobra Jets, but had stronger internals. This summary comparison of major 428 engine components was prepared by Bill Barr, Principal Engineer for the 428 Cobra Jet engine development program at Ford Motor Company. Cyclone CJ comes with four-speed stick competition handling package, wide-tread fiberglass belted WSW tires, blackout grille, hood stripe, all-vinyl cockpit, low-restriction dual pipesall standard. are identical. Initially, Ford limited production to only 50, but later increased that by 250 due to popular demand. Credit: CarsRememberWhenAutoSales/Wikipedia. However, a 4-speed option was also available. The 428's and 429's most associated with Cougars are Cobra Jets. So instead, you have to examine the axle code on the door tag for a V or a W to verify its legit. Ford released new versions of the Cobra Jet Mustang in 2010, 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016, and 2018, making 50 annually. Register now for free! Combined with their burgeoning competition with the new Chevy Camaro, Ford decided to put a modified 428 heavily based on Tascas 428 into the Mustang for 1968. The cast iron intake manifold was a high-rise style, which was exceedling heavy at 90 lbs. Although the Mustang had been completely redone, little changed in the CJ engine for 1969, and it was still available in any type of Mustang. The fifth digit in the VIN on any Ford from 1968-1970 tells you whether or not a vehicle came with this engine or not. Last month, we brought you Part 1 of 3 on how to detail a 428 Cobra Jet engine to concourse level, with Marcus Anghel of . . They were almost a direct fit, and Tasca called his new creation the KR-8 Mustang. With a bore and stroke of 4.36 X 3.59, the 429 has a larger bore but smaller stroke than the 428s. The 1967 Shelby GT500 featured a new 428 cid engine that had been used in the Thunderbirds and Galaxies. Originally available in any of the three Mustang body styles--coupe, fastback, or convertible--all '68 CJ Mustangs are highly sought after, even 30 years later. It was available in the new Camaro in 325-, 350-, and 375hp forms (a 425hp version had been available in the Corvette for '65). Bought a new 69 Mach 1 and ran at the strip w best et 12.72. (REGISTERED USERS DO NOT SEE THIS POST/AD! The 396 was a durable and slightly detuned racing engine that ran very hard. Ford execs got the word. While the print ad boasted leading the way, the Cyclone CJ ended up closer to the middle of the pack in 1969, coming in 12th overall in factory supercar quarter-mile times published that year. Ford had introduced the 385 series in 1968, and the 429 first appeared in the Thunderbird. Sales success of the Mustang had been phenomenal in its first two years, and Ford wanted more. Performance options aplenty: tach, styled steel wheels, power front disc brakes, power steering, Traction-Lok differential (3.50, 3.91 or 4.30 axel ratios), bucket seats, racing mirroryou name it. Past Cats: '69 Std. Cast iron exhaust manifolds. Block, heads, manifolds, etc. Ford had first introduced the public to the new Ford Cobra jet powered Mustangs at the 1968 NHRA Winternationals. The Cougar was available in either standard or XR-7 trim, with option packages including the GT and the performance-trim Eliminator. Because of the long throw, the 428 was more of a low rpm / torque motor were as the 427 was a high rpm race motor. all aluminum FE, Check the intake casting number, the head casting number and if the heads are of the bore and stroke. Certainly the 428 was a torque machine, and if you had enough carburetor for about 5,000 rpms, that was about as fast you needed to spin that engine anyway. See more Reply Save Like 1 Required fields are marked *. What is the difference between a 428 and 429. The program was engineered, designed, tested, validated, released, and certified between January 1967 and August 1968. Thought they would both go same time. The Ford 428 Cobra Jet was the high-performance version of the 428 FE engine, quickly overtaking the low-revving 390 CID V-8 as the high-performance powerplant of choice. JavaScript is disabled. 1968 through 1970 428CJ blocks were beefed up between the bores and main webbing areas for anticipated higher horsepower output. : For registered members this ad will NOT show, Cobra Make, Engine: Unique Motorcars (sold). The facts became clear once 428 CJ Mustangs and Fairlanes started running high 13s at the strip with zero preparation. The Formal Roof versions were the ultimate sleeper, looking like your average everyday grocery getter to any unsuspecting contenders that pulled up next to it at a red light. In the August 1968 issue of Super Stock & Drag Illustrated magazine, a 68 Cougar XR7-GT tripped the quarter-mile in 13.23 seconds, traveling at 103.4 miles per hour. Ford rated the engine at 335 horsepower and 440 lb-ft of torque, but that was probably understated for insurance purposes. Welcome to Club Cobra! 1968 428 Cobra Jet Drag Strip Modifications 428 CJ Mustangs at the 1968 NHRA Winternationals Drag Strip Performance The Straight Scoop on "Canadian" Heads Engine Information 428 Cobra Jet History, by Bill Barr 428 Cobra Jet vs. 428 Super Cobra Jet Comparison of Major 428 Engine Components Component Identification Engine Identification Codes The largest was the 390 cid, which Ford first brought out in 1961. In 1969, Ford created an even higher performance version, known as the 428 Super Cobra Jet. Ford wanted to develop a new high-performance engine to help compete against other newly introduced pony cars that had stolen market share. Twenty three years later 1992 bought a 289 GT Coup but soon installed a FE with cylender head mods and solid roller cam have ran a best 1.33 60 foot and a 6.39 eighth mile. They did have a few XR7-G Cougars built that came with the first factory retractable sunroof though! The 351 Cobra Jet was the final Cobra Jet engine that Ford released, and it lasted from 1971-1974. It was only installed in mid-size (1970-71) and pony cars (1971 only). Whenever a . Hi Keiththis Ford Article isn't the best scan I've ever done but the article is very, Location: Abe Lincolns Birthplace, The 390 big-block version of the Mustang ran fairly well--well enough to post mid-15-second times in the quarter-mile. Ordering either of these axle ratio options commonly triggered a few other upgrades as well, including the 428 Super Cobra Jet engine, an external oil cooler mounted in front of the radiator, and relocation of the driver's side horn to the passenger side of the radiator core support to make room for the oil cooler. The 428, on the other hand, has a smaller bore and longer stroke producing more torque and is well-suited to street-strip action. By far and away the most common -- they made 100,000+ of these. While the torque claim was in line with expectations, many wondered why the big 428 CJ was only 10 ponies ahead of the 325hp 390 GT four-barrel mill. Register now for free! There have been rumors of cars being delivered with SCJ engines and other axle codes, and V- or W-code axles and no SCJ engine. The value of a Cobra Jet will differ, depending on the body style, options, and year of the car. I am a 351W guy. It was very similar to the standard 351 Cleveland engine, but with a few key differences. Welcome to Club Cobra! In 1958, Ford introduced their first line of big block motors, known as the Ford FE engines. George Anderson of Gessford Machine was kind enough to point me to a page from Ford's "Muscle Parts Description and Interchange" book, a supplement to the original "Muscle Parts" catalog that was published in July 1970, that clearly states that "all 428 engines use "dished" cast aluminum pistons with two sets of eyebrows cast so they can be used in right or left bank". Note that there is no mention of the Detroit Locker in the 1969 description, but it's clearly listed in the 1970 description. The 351 Ford Cobra jet also had four-bolt mains, hydraulic valve lifters, high lift/duration cams, and larger valves than the standard 351. At the '68 NHRA Winternationals in Pomona, California, Ford entered a number of specially warmed-up '68 Cobra Jet Mustangs. Also does the cj have a lot of low end. Instead of a Cobra or Super Cobra Jet engine, the new Mustang Cobra Jets feature modified existing production engines. Super Cobra Jet harmonic balancer counter weight, 2 We have 2 blocks here-both are 428s but one has some additional webbing on the main bearings. I won Winter Nationals at Beeline Dragway in DStock Class at 13:05 118 mph in 1970 with my 428 CJ Mach. Of course there's the Boss 429, but thats a horse of completely different color. The 1968 Mustang received several styling updates, including side scoops, steering wheel, side marker lights, and gas cap. Super Cobra Jet harmonic balancer Untamed European elegance indeed. Most 428 Cobra Jet fans have heard of the "Detroit Locker" differential, a positive locking differential that was originally produced by Detroit Automotive Products Corporation (DAPCO) and is now available from TracTech Inc. And this dealer-inspired Ford racing engine couldnt have appeared at a better time for the Ford Motor Company. I've seen written reference to a C9AE-C rod also being used, but I've never been able to confirm an installation. Last edited: May 19, 2013 FrozenMerc, May 19, 2013 SHARE POST #3 hoop98 Member Ford 428s had a different water jacket core which can often be identified by the "428" cast in the bottom of the inner water jacket right under the center freeze plug.